Can't say i've ever mixed uppers and downers but whats the verdict, is it safe?
I was always under the impression you take a downer if you're overdosing on an upper and vice versa, however, a thread in OD has lead me to believe that this is not the case and there was the whole shpeal about how dangerous speedballing was. But, to take another upper/downer combo, i always thought the danger of mixing coke and alchol was the byproduct produced not the actual mixing of a downer and upper. Anyway, throughly confused... whats the final word?

Sparing you all the neuropsychological mumbo jumbo...
As a general rule of thumb, mixing drugs (2 or more) = greater damage
there are some combinations that are more safer than others (weed and most drugs for example) but by the same token there are some whos damage is multiplied (amphetamines and mdma is hella fun, but really bad for your brain).
Also, mixing uppers and downers should technically cancel each other out. The reality of this is slightly different (i have found mixing speed with alcohol leaves me fairly wired, only feeling a little bit of the alcohol) but it all depends on what youve taken and how much of it.
As always you should research exactly what drugs you are planning to mix (bluelight, pillreports, erowid, lyceaum etc) and look after yourself on the night (sufficient water, cooling, rest periods, vitamins etc) and don't forget to have a good time!

Mixing uppers and downers at the same time is not safe. But then again, no drug use is safe so as far as a final word goes the short answer is no...
That said, it really depends what particular substances you're talking about. Alcohol and Cocaine is a different case, because together in the liver they create cocaethelyne (sp?). Heroin and Cocaine makes your heart do hula-hoops and unless you're reasonably fit you might be in strife...
Basically, the combination of uppers and downers multiplies the straign on your body's ability to regulate itself. For example, one thing might be telling your heart to pump faster, while another is trying to slow it down.
If anyone is going to intentionally mix uppers and downers, make sure extra caution is taken. :-)
[ 14 December 2002: Message edited by: Pleonastic ]

^
What he said.
It can put tremendous strain on the heart and confuse the hell out of your nervous system. One drug is saying to your CNS 'go faster go faster!' the other is saying 'goooo slooooow' and your body basically says 'what the fuck?'.
Mixing is generally a no no.
However the flipside of this is: should you mix two of the same? Speed and coke? (nope, the effect each of these on the brain basically makes this a dangerous combo) Alcohol and GHB? (sleepy sleeps? maybe forever...) Valium and Heroin? (a new number to add to the 2nd page of the Herald-Sun)
Polydrug abuse can be more dangerous than single use. Especially when you get to the stimulants and depressant class drugs. Hallucinagenic drugs can usually be mixed with something else without much fear of dire consequencies (Acid and MDMA come to mind) although there are of course some combinations to be specifically avoided (DXM + MDMA anyone?)

[quote]Originally posted by Pleonastic:
That said, it really depends what particular substances you're talking about. Alcohol and Cocaine is a different case, because together in the liver they create cocaethelyne (sp?).
Not knowing much about coke in general, is cocaethylene a bad substance? Or is that why its a "different case"?

[quote] (sleepy sleeps? maybe forever...)
[ 14 December 2002: Message edited by: tranquilo ]

[quote]Originally posted by villz:
Not knowing much about coke in general, is cocaethylene a bad substance? Or is that why its a "different case"?The reason I said it's a different case than basic upper/downer mixing, is because in combination an entirely new substance is created. So while coke has stimulent effects and alcohol has depressent effects, there's also the cocaethylene to factor in which complicates the question.
Cocaethylene is a toxic substance, and is worse for your body than just alcohol or just coke on it's own... that said though it also makes you feel pretty damn good, and is the reason why so many people have a couple of drinks when they have coke...
I guess it comes down to a risk/benefit assessment (which really should be done whenever you consume any substances). Is the extra good feeling I'll get worth the extra strain on my body?
[ 14 December 2002: Message edited by: Pleonastic ]

After a night out on uppers, I usually snort some normison (temazepam) to help me get to sleep..
I guess that's mixing, but there's a few hours in between so maybe not all that relevant to your question (?)..
Anyhow, I find that it works REALLY well for me so I thought I'd share..
F&L
Sharing is caring :-)

Its pretty simple, taking an upper with a downer cancels some of the effects. And thus is easier to overdose because you are less aware of the effect of the drugs already in your system. Very careful dose monitoring could combat this.

Put your foot on the accelerator... The car goes faster.
Rail some meth... Your CNS speeds up.
Put your foot on the break... The car slows down.
Have a few beers... Your CNS slows down.
Drive with one foot on the accelerator and another on the break... The car still moves, but with excessive strain on the engine which could, in the short term, cost ya money in repairs... In the long term, it may effect it's life expectancy.
Think of your CNS in the same way.
:-)
[ 18 December 2002: Message edited by: apollo ]

^^^^^
That's the best fucking description of how it works that i've ever read. :-)
Permission to steal that analogy in the future (with full credit of course)?

i dont really mix uppers and downers, but as someone else said, after a big night, if i cant sleep but i know i need it, ill take temazepam to get to sleep . . . ive always wondered how bad this is?

nice one apollo!
good explanation :-)

i have happily mixed weed with pills or speed on many previous occasions, and to be honest, i know little about the problems of mixing uppers and downers.
originally i always thought it was bad, yet many people i encountered never seemed to worry, so i gave it a go.
i have to say its one of the most enjoyable combos. kinda stupid that i didnt read up on it more beforehand i know!

Cocaethylene is something that coke sniffing banannas must produce. The combination of cocaine and ethanol synergise to create cocaethanol in your liver, the effects or toxicology of which i am unsure of although i hear combining alcohol with la coca seems to smoothen the anxiety and paranoia of straight coke. Polydrug use is worse for you, than single substances, im sure most of us have learnt the hard way re weed and ethanol contraindiction. I found myself at a party taking speed to nullify the effects of alcohol and weed and thinking whats the point, but that's how i regard speed for me it's functional it enables me to do other stuff very rarely do i take speed for the pure sake of having speed. The party was good i had a rocking time... so guess there was the point.... in not falling over. On the whole upper+downers=splatt

Using a benzodiazepine in the normal dose range on a comedown shouldn't be dangerous, providing you:
1. have used the benzodiazepine before with no problems,
2. don't have asthma or other respiratory problems
3. don't take other CNS depressants as well, like alcohol, opiates or G
Don't know why you'd want to snort temazepam though - it works just dandy orally.
This is not the same as combining a stimulant and a depressant at the same time however...Generally speaking, taking 2 drugs simultaneously increases the risks associated with each drug. Sure, there are some exceptions to the rule but still...
[ 19 December 2002: Message edited by: babydoc_vic ]

why? coz everything goes up my nose.. :-)

^ Since most benzo's are sparingly soluble in water, you're just snorting them into your throat and swallowing them anyway - same as taking it orally but slower to come on. There is little or no benefit in snorting benzodiazepines.
From an OtherDrugs Forum post on snorting sleeping pills:
[quote]OnceUponAnX....
Greenlighter
posted 18 December 2002 23:50 (ip) ()
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Being the fuck head that i am I have snorted many a bizzare substance, usually while pissed. Here is a few:
Temazepam - OUCH! This shit burns your nose like nothing else. Doesn't really do much except make the front of your head feel like its about to burst.
Diazepam - As above
Prozac - Again not too pleasant but does make your head tingle and standing up is difficult immediately afterwards
Dyhadra-codeine(excuse spelling) - Got these on prescription when i broke my leg. Powerful pain killer but i do not recommend snorting, painful. Made me feel like shit for about 6 hours.
All in All i say do what it says on the tin. I think the guidelines are their for a reason.
BTW - I dont snort dumb shit anymore, older and wiser.
BigTrancer :-)

You're absolutely right BT, and so is the person you quoted..
I'm just a fan of the 'drip-p-p-age' and the whole numb face thing makes me feel all smacked out and fuzzy, that's primarily why I do it..
I prefer Valium, it goes down (up) much better, (burn factor wise) but I seem to come across Normisons more easily so you gotta make do with what you got :-)
Quote: "BTW - I dont snort dumb shit anymore, older and wiser."
Funny that, I seem to be going in the opposite direction.. I might be older, probably wiser, but I seem to be getting more careless coz I've fallen in a comfort zone when it comes to drugs in general.. must be the familiarity factor..

So whats the general opinion on weed and mdma? Melancholic touched on it and mentioned that it was a great experience. I would have to agree.......I have only smoked weed once while I was peaking off a pill and thought it was great!
I found that the weed seemed to magnify the effects of the pill just as it magnifies the effects of everything else(for me anyway). Consequently only one pill was needed as opposed to two or three. I presume this experience is fairly common...
Apollo that was a great analogy!

[quote] Most people find the MDMA state so valuable by itself that it's not clear there's much to be gained from combining MDMA with most other substances (though the combination of of MDMA with LSD seems to have a strong following). Further, combining drugs ("polydrug use" and "polydrug abuse") complicates the medical and behavioral safety picture. For this reason, it is not a recommended practice in the absence of expert guidance. Here is a chart of commonly encountered drugs and some of their reactions when combined with MDMA:
Marijuana: Not known for dangerous reactions. MJ is habit-forming for some users.
thank you erowid :-)
err, habit forming?! ... i wont mention that since mixing weed n pills together for the first time around 8 months ago, i havent had a pill without its partner.... :-)
Shame on me, ive had trouble finding information on erowid regarding the speed and weed combination. anybody else had some luck?
[ 22 December 2002: Message edited by: melancholic ]

I just don't seem to get any great effects from MDMA or acid until I have a joint, unless they were taken in high doses. For me, I can have one pill and a few joint's and be at the same level as if I had taken 3 pills, but without the bad comedown the next day.
I am assuming that one pill and a few joint's would be better for my body than three pills?
Anyone have any idea?

couple of pills versus a couple of joints... i dont think theres been enough research to accurately say which is the more harmful to the body... but according to what we do know, id go as far as saying if youre generally quite healthy, have left ample time since your last roll for your body to recuporate, you pre-load properly, eat a couple pills, followed by a decent post-load, a relaxing day and all the correct foods; then no more than or possibly less harm could be done than having 1 pill a couple of joints.
as far as im concerned, mdma causes me problems if i use it more than once or twice a month. and i spose the same goes for weed, cept theres a tendency to smoke weed more often 'cos its only weed' and i think its doing me more harm than MDMA. think of lungs (moreover, the entire respiratory system), think of motivation, think of eating patterns, think of concentration levels, memory etc etc the list goes on. and maybe MDMA effects some of these things as well, but if used as i stated above, i think it would be less harmful.