As the search-engine didn't yield anything, I'd like to ask here whether anyone has lately come across this substance and what their experiences were. All I know about it is what Shulgin wrote ....
Thread: The Big & Dandy HOT-7 Thread
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Last edited by Solipsis; 30-04-2012 at 23:21.
wow, first time i'd heard of this one. love that name ;D
Here is the PiHKaL excerpt from Shulgin:
Kind of interesting, noticeably the sexual side-effects. Seems to be quite enjoyed by him for its psychedelics attributes as well. It is made from 2C-T-17.
It will just dehydroxylate into 2CT7 in the stomach I think. It will be identical to 2CT7 subjectively. The reason why this is not more evident in Shulgin's reports are that he did not do a wide enough swath of tests (plus with the power of suggestion that he undoubtedly hyped up to his testers).
Here's a quote from the FLEA passage (hydroxy-MDMA).
Originally Posted by Shulgin
Also, there are a few hydroxylated drugs known and distributed. For instance, Parahydroxyamphetamine and parahydroxymethamphetamine have been 'on the street' and I believe have killed.
Also, PMA (paramethoxyamphetamine), you might recognize this drug, it gets demethylated in vivo to PHA (the drug above). It has caused fatal cases of serotonin syndrome when mixed with MDMA.
The HOT series (hydroxylate a 2CT and you got a HOT) is as far as I know theoretical to us 'commoners' at this point, although it would not be hard to synthesize I dont think.
The problem with HOT7 is that part of it would like decompose to regular 2CT7 making it illegal to possess within the US (don't know about other country's drug laws).
So, the drug probably decomposes to t7 ex vivo as well as in vivo.
Maybe the mods want to think about shifting this to ADD, since none of us have experience here in PD with it (or does somebody???). I think when there is not a chance for subjective reports (where this forum shines), then ADD might be a better place (chemistry is def not my strong point!).
06-03-2008 16:30Originally Posted by samadhi_smiles
Indeed... I think the Aco-Ts have shown us that oxidation in the body does not necessarily mean the effects will be identical.
Anyone else think we should move this to ADD?
well I think that 4-aco-Ts can cross the BBB (see the thread in this forum on the first page about my and others thoughts on it). So it really is a bit of a disanalogy.
Do you think the difference in time and effects could be due to not a large enough sample size for HOT7? I do.
I think a lot of shulgin's work is flawed for this very reason (aleph-1 comes to mind!).
For instance, my +3 trip on 2CT7 (I usually only try each phenethylamine once out of curiousity) was 6 hours (though I plugged it). Not 12.
That said, I'd pay lots for some HOT7 since I loved t7 so much. It was WONDERFUL WONDERFUL stuff. But, I'm talking to you about that (preaching to the choir).
>Do you think the difference in time and
>effects could be due to not a large enough
>sample size for HOT7? I do.
Not personally. I've worked with threshold and sub-threshold of T7, and it was never just a 6-8hr experience. But I acknowledge that T7 is quite variable from person to person. And in your case, it was plugged...not eaten.
And with HOT-17 being listed as a 12-18hr experience, I'm confident something is different from the 2C-Ts. But pure speculation...someone bring some out and I'll test for myself!
And in the interest of art......
A HydrOxyThiophenthylamine (of the N-hydroxylated, 2,5-dimethoxylated, 4-substituted-phenethylamines kind of course) .....
Last edited by morninggloryseed; 06-03-2008 at 20:44.
It looks as ugly as other phenethylamines with a 4-methylthio group, but thats just me... I think sulphur makes things stink (and it usually does, now that I think about it...) .
that's a really interesting looking molecule, MGS. for some reason it sticks out to me in terms of appearance.
06-03-2008 21:33Originally Posted by samadhi_smiles
^I can echo this wrt. oral dosing duration. I cannot comment on rectal, since T-7 is one of the few I haven't tried that way, and have no intention on doing so.
06-03-2008 22:17I've worked with threshold and sub-threshold of T7, and it was never just a 6-8hr experience. But I acknowledge that T7 is quite variable from person to person. And in your case, it was plugged...not eaten.
And with HOT-17 being listed as a 12-18hr experience, I'm confident something is different from the 2C-Ts.
DP, so do you think its just a prodrug for the respective 2CTx?
Or maybe the other way round? Google turned up lots of drugs that are apparently metabolised to hydroxylamines. It seems to me to make sense too, it could function as a handle to aid excretion or metabolism. I don't really know.
ah interesting, yeah PMA is demethylated into PHA (as per my post above) and it does seem like a few others are similar.
In any event, I've seen it on the market only once and in all likelihood a more accurate description of the substance being pandered would be NOT-7.
The hole hot series is quite interesting. Will hot-7 for example still show the MAOI activity of its non-hydroxy counterpart??
07-03-2008 16:38Originally Posted by tobala
Hot-7. I bet you that Shulging thought himself quite the wit with that name. Is it not still considered a 2C, two carbons ET. AL.?
Well I believed he coined the word "tweetio" himself and at one point had considered calling a series of his creations TWAT-X.
The guy obviously watched too many cartoons in his youth, probably along the genre of Fritz the Cat...old genius bastard...
He actually comments on his naming at several places in PiHKAL. The one I particularly remember is in the commentary for the MAL entry, and how "MAL" reflects the nature of the drug.
08-03-2008 18:15Originally Posted by samadhi_smiles
That's because of an enzyme (catechol O-methyl transferase) with PMA. With hydroxylamines like these, you only need the slightest decomposition of the hydroxylamine to the amine and you are deep in the merde with absolutely no excuse to fall back on.
In terms of where you stand legally, I'd rate them in the same category as ALD-52 ie by the time LE get ahold of it, there'll be some traces of the compounds you really don't it to have degraded to