I have found a drug that may be similar to either ethanol or ethchlorvynol.
Maybe Advanced Drug Discussion would have been a better place since this is pretty much unknown as a rec drug. Mods can decide.
I'd like to know if the binding to the receptors in the brain should be more like ethchlorvinyl or ethanol, and I know some folks there have that type of knowledge. Maybe they could tell by the shape of the molecule or something. I'm hoping it'll have a lot of similarity to ethchlorvinyl or maybe something between it and ethanol.
I don't want something that will be just like alcohol unless it lacks most of the side effects.
This is what Wikipedia has to say about the topic:
I doubt anyone has tried this, but if so, I'd love to hear about it. The fact that it has previously found use in medicine as a sedative and hypnotic and is structurally related to ethchlorvynol (Brand name Placidyl) gives me some hope that it could be be good stuff, or at least better than ethanol. If more like ethchlorvynol than ethanol, I'd definitely want some, if just for treating insomnia.Originally Posted by Wikipedia
I could get it right now if I wanted to, and it may be a common unwatched chemical that can be freely purchased by anyone. I'm going to find as much more info as I can about this. I did a few searches and didn't find much of interest. The MSDS wasn't helpful in determining relative toxicity to ethanol, the drug it was compared to.
If it is just like ethanol. then I don't see much point in trying it. There just isn't enough info to tell. Maybe it is more or less toxic or euphoric. If it were just like ethanol, or worse, then I don't want it. If it possesses fewer side effects/less hangover it would be nice. More euphoria would also be good. I'd like it if it were just a good sedative.
Maybe I'll give in to curiosity and find out for myself by buying some. It apparently isn't too toxic since it has seen medical use. If this is, then that is a significant difference right there. At least not to the point where I'll kill myself by trying it at a moderate dose a time or two.
I'll have to see if I can find any info on possible carcinogenicity, as that would be a turn off.
I will let you all know if I try it, as I have never heard mention of it before and had no idea it was a drug.
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Last edited by Tryptamine*Dreamer; 07-05-2009 at 08:01.
I have decided to give it a try. I'll let everyone know what the effects and side effects are like once I try it. I am hoping it will not be too similar to ethanol. I am hoping it will be more like ethchlorvynol, or perhaps that it will share some of the effects of both those drugs. Whatever it is like, I hope it is euphoric and lacks serious side effects.
I'll just toss it out or resell it if it feels toxic.
I did find some info in old medical textbooks saying that it does not cause headaches, nausea, and some of the other symptoms associated with ethanol. It seems to have mostly been used as a sedative, and it sounds as though it might be quite strong as a sedative.
Active doses are 2-4 grams according to wikipedia. I'm going to start with half a gram, wait an hour, and take another gram or so if the first small dose feels ok or isn't felt.
One book says it's effects are something between chloral hydrate and paraldehyde.
Last edited by Tryptamine*Dreamer; 08-05-2009 at 02:32.
I was similarly interested in Chlorobutanol at one point. And Potassium Bromide.
All of these drugs give me the horrors thinking about them now. While you seem to be taking safety into consideration, I wouldn't expect it to act any differently than a nauseating, alcohol-like chemical lobotomy, ending in a long period of sleep and next day grogginess.
On the other hand, Bretazenil & Pagoclone sound far more interesting, and pleasant I would love to see a euphoric sedative in tablet form available OTC to compete with alcohol; as, like the Wiki article mentions, there is a readily available and effective antidote for Benzodiazepine-like drugs, plus they do not cause the physical damage to the liver and other organs like alcohol.
Did you try the substance that is the topic of this thread, or one similar to it? I'd love to hear about it if you did. Maybe you are right, and it will be horrible. I'm starting really low and will only go higher if it lacks side effects. It could be like a dirtier ethanol, but medical sources seem to imply that it doesn't have any major side effects and compare it to several sedatives other than ethanol. None of the medical texts that mentioned it compared it to ethanol, but did compare to several other sedatives. These are old books, mostly 1920s and older. One of the comparisons in at least two books was chloral hydrate.
It is to late to not spend the money now, I've already paid for it. I probably would have anyway, even after reading your post. There is no way to know what it will be like until someone tries it, and I am just so very curious after finding out about it.
If it is as horrible as you think it may be, I shouldn't suffer much starting at a small fraction of the recommended dose and slowly working upward. I knew when I brought it that I was taking a big risk of ending up with something useless as a drug. The possibility that it could be more like one of the more pleasant sedatives to which medical texts compare it or to which it has structural similarities made it worth risking, IMO. Especially considering the low price.
I really hope it is good stuff, but my expectations are not and never were really high, as much as it may have seemed they were in previous posts.
As I said previously, I will let everyone know how it goes. I am affected worse than most people by the side effects of ethanol, or at least I think so. If this is an ethanol-like drug with even worse side effects, I'm sure I'll figure that out fast.
My experiment will either serve to make known a pleasant or useful sedative, or to make it known that this is something to stay away from.
I will describe my experiments with this drug in detail to give everyone as clear a picture as possible of its effects. I'll also compare it with ethanol, benzos, zolpidem, and a few other sedatives.
The fact that it is an alcohol does not necessarily mean it is going to be a lot like ethanol. If it is like ethanol, perhaps it will have less side effects, not more. Probably not, but who knows?
I'm hoping it will be similar to ethchlorvinyl, which has structural similarities and sounds pretty pleasant. I probably won't be that lucky, but I can hope.
It clearly is not very toxic(though could be worse than ethanol), since it was used medically for a long time. I'm not going to kill myself and probably won't even make myself feel too bad the way I plan on doing things. At worst, I will have wasted some money. A month or two ago I would not have risked that money on something that will more likely than not be a useless chemical. I have since got a part time job(10hr/week) which when combined with my other income sources is more than enough to pay my mom for living with her, pay for food, and pay for more drugs than I could afford before.
Anyway, thanks for warning me that this could be more like a dirtier version of ethanol with worse side effects. I was already thinking that there was a good chance of that, but maybe I failed to mention it.
I like to try as many new things as I can. Even though I know it will likely suck, I am more excited about trying this than I have been about any new drug I've tried in a long time. The fact that it is pretty much unknown and no first hand accounts of the effects just really excite me.
I'll do 0.5g and increase in increments of 0.5g until getting desired effects or undesired side effects. I may even try a 0.25g dose for my first time. I may dose twice the first day if it can be done eight or more hours apart.
I don't know why I made the post this long. I went over some of the things several times.
I may try Bretazenil and/or Pagoclone if it becomes available, but from a quick search it does not seem to be readily available.
I wish there was something better than alcohol available OTC with depressant effects. I'm hoping the chemical I'm trying will fit that description, but I am likely to be disappointed. At least I can easily get benzos and a variety of other sedatives cheaply. It would be nice to not have to worry about legal consequences of getting caught, or of failing a drug test and losing your job. I don't think I will be given any drug tests, and my job is only 10 hours per week and pays near minimum wage, so it wouldn't be a great loss. Plenty of others have lost good jobs for failing drug tests. My brother almost lost his job about 10 years ago for taking a dose of his/my mother's prescription cough medicine, not knowing it contained an opiate that would cause him to fail the drug test. This brother has never used drugs AFAIK, doesn't even drink or smoke.
Last edited by Tryptamine*Dreamer; 09-05-2009 at 08:43.
- Join Date
- Jul 2003
I've tried a very similar compound, 2-methyl-3-butyn-2-ol. This is the same as 2-methyl-2-butanol, just with a triple bond. I think it's supposed to be a bit more potent.
It gives you a sort of generic sedation that's somewhat nice. You have to take at least 1ml to feel anything and more like 3ml or even more to feel it fully. Often you end up taking even more.
I'd say it's not as good/enjoyable as 1-ethynyl-1-cyclohexanol, but besides that it has at least two advantages. First, it is water soluble, so you can just mix it with some juice or something. (I found multivitamin drink and a drop of peppermint oil works good, this masks the horrible taste.) Second it is much much cheaper.
I'm not sure it's the best substance for your body though, as I get a strange taste in my mouth several days after using it. Also one time I got this white icky stuff come out of the tonsils. And if you take a high dose, which is easy to do, you will feel sedation for one or more days afterwards.
One of my friends took a very high dose (~25ml) and ended up in the hospital for several days. Lesson learned: don't give experimental drugs to junkies.
You might want to look up Science 114: 384 (1951) and Arch. Biochem. Biophys. 33:482 (1953) for info on this compound and it's close relative methylpentynol.
I have not taken any of the aforementioned compounds as of yet. My mind is still open to the possibility of medicinal self-prescription (i.e. using Sodium Bromide when insomnia can't be overcome, etc).
The class of Ethanol-like/Chloral Hydrate-like drugs sound very good on paper, and I have seen texts similar to the ones you describe that make any of these compounds sound great.
However, look at what they are comparing it to. Late 19th, early 20th century sedatives were Ethanol, Sulfonmethane (Sulfonal), the Bromides, Chloral Hydrate, etc. Compared to these, especially when you consider the severe gastric distress/pain and other awful side effects, any slight improvement like a less severe side effect, or a lack of one side effect, may seem like a big step forward.
I am still very interested in trying and using Barbital- which, in the same old textbooks, is touted as a miracle drug when compared to the aforementioned sedatives. Barbiturates are much more pleasing to the mind and body than Benzodiazepines in my opinion.
But, back on topic-
I wish you lots of luck if you do indeed move forward with the experiment. Please be careful, start low.
I did get it today. I tried .5g of it first, and got a slight but indistinct buzz. I am now on 1.5g, and it is easy to feel the nature of the effects. It does have similarities to ethanol, but the feeling is significantly different. I can definitely say I feel more euphoria than I would with a similar level of ethanol. I'm not sure what else I can compare it to. Their are similarities to ethanol, but it is certainly not the same, or even that close, IMO.
It takes about 10 minutes to kick in. I am feeling no side effects right now. I will just wait and see if I get any kind of hangover.
It is not quite what I hoped it would be, but I will be happy with it if it does not cause any significant side effects. It does feel quite nice right now. I found that 1ml is equal to 840mg. If I find 1.5-3g to be a good dose range, that means I have many doses.
I'll report back to tell how I feel after it has worn off. I'll also report the effects of higher doses.
The nature of the experience seems to be changing still. I feel very relaxed and calm, and happy. Very peaceful. I could see this becoming a more widely used substance if the side effects turn out to be minimal and the word gets out about it.
I think it could be really nice at a higher dose, maybe 2.5-3g.
I'll just wait and see what kind of aftereffects this has.
What I can say is that it is definitely a sedative, and it has some similarities to ethanol, but many differences. It induces a very peaceful, calm, relaxed state with a nice gentle euphoria. I'd say I like it better than benzos or similar sedatives. I definitely like the effects more than ethanol.
It feels better now than it felt when I first started typing this. I probably hadn't given it time to fully kick in, since it had only been 10-15min after dosing.
I sure hope it has no hangover with it. I probably won't know that for a while.
It will be interesting to see if 2-methyl-2-butanol works well for taking the edge off of a trip...
I may try that if the need arises.
I didn't feel any sort of hangover, but I was still a little under the influence this morning, like 12 hours after the last dose. I could also still taste it when I burped. It has a pretty strong taste and smell. You could probably smell it on the breath of anyone who uses it if you got too close.
The maximum level of intoxication was about like 4 or 5 beers, which is about as much as I can drink without a hangover. Not that it felt the same as drinking ethanol. I like this better, and the two drugs are not really that similar. They do share some of the same effects, but you could easily feel the difference. I think this chemical is more euphoric and more sedating than ethanol would be at the same level. I slept well last night.
The long duration and the smell/taste are the only things so far that I think I'd change. It probably can't be used as a sedative if you are worried about people close to you smelling it on your breath. I'm not sure how close you'd need to be though, maybe right up in their face. I was tasting it in my own mouth when I burped, but maybe it would not be easily detected by others.
The lack of negative effects so far doesn't mean this chemical is safe to ingest on a regular basis, if at all. It may cause brain damage that only becomes noticeable after many uses. It may cause cancer. Who knows? I don't plan on using this whole bottle because I want to limit my exposure.
It may still have negative aftereffects at higher doses, though I don't think I'd want or need to push the dose up much if any further than I did last night.
I did another 2.5g dose right before bed. I was watching a TV show and wanted to finish that, but fell asleep right before it ended. I don't know that there would be much point of going above 3-4g at a time. You might end up just wanting to sleep.
I'll post some more when I use some more of it. It is hard to tell for sure from one time what it's effects and aftereffects will be like. Also, I did have some alprazolam and gabapentin earlier. They seemed to have worn off, but there could have been enough left in my system to have a major influence on effects.
Just be very careful. Easy access to cheap and powerful front brain depressants leads to a very nasty habit. GBL and 1,4-BDO are ruining a lot of peoples health, well being and lives overall due to this combination of factors.
I bet it has a similar habituation period as typical sedative-hypnotics: Methaqualone, Glutethimide, Ethchlorvynol, etc. I bet tolerance sets in rapidly, and abstinence syndrome will quickly follow.
The rebound symptoms caused by the abstinence syndrome following regular, tolerant use and habituation is probably just as painful, severe and dangerous as that of GHB, Xanax, Methaqualone, etc.
Please be careful.
Does anyone know what the metabolites of ingesting this would be?
It seems like 2-methyl-2-butanol, at least from this report, would be similar, but if I could hear a bit more on this from someone who's tried both that would be awesome. I'm not too into psychedelics or stimulants, so its very rare that I hear of a novel drug that I would probably enjoy, but it sounds like this is one I should sample if ever given the opportunity.
I've never tried chloral hydrate. It is one of the things I'd like to try. I may try to make some some time.
You may already know this, but the effects of chloral hydrate are caused by the metabolite 2,2,2-Trichlorethanol.
I don't plan to use this very often, and will not be using the whole bottle. I am probably going to try it tomorrow night with nothing in my system but poppies(a small dose) so that I can better feel what the effects are like.
I haven't tried GHB, GBL, or any of the things similar to that. The only things I can compare it to are ethanol, benzos, and zolpidem. Out of those, it is most like ethanol, but seems quite a bit different so far. I can say that any hangover should be less severe than ethanol, because I got no hangover at all. The effects last longer than I'd like though. I could still taste it when I burped 12 hours after dosing and I think I was still a little under the influence 10-12 hours post ingestion.
Chloral hydrate does seem like it'd be easy to make, and I didn't know that it was actually a prodrug, I always figured the effects were due to the chloral itself! Thats interesting though.
2-methyl-2-butanol seems like something I'd like to try, thanks so much for posting all this info, TD. My only concern would be its duration of action; 10-12 hours seems like a really long time to be intoxicated, but I'm guessing alot of that time would be spent sleeping. It seems like alot of the GABAergic drugs are much milder, hangover-wise, than ethanol, but I guess thats due to ethanol's unique ability to dehydrate and leach vitamins out of one's system.
Did you find the 2-methyl-2-butanol (we gotta think of a shorter slang term for this...2M2B maybe?) to be inherently euphoric? As in, more euphoria-inducing than alcohol? I thought chloral hydrate to be fairly euphoric, and GHB is reported to be as well, so I am just wondering. I love ethanol and all, but a GABAergic drug that got me sloppy while having a bit more of a mood lift than alcohol would be nice.
It did seem more euphoric than ethanol. It is possible that this could be because I had some alprazolam and gabapentin earlier in the day. Those seemed to have worn off, but small amounts remaining in my system could have altered the effects of this chemical.
I am probably going to try it tomorrow without using anything else other than a small dose of poppies, which I need to prevent withdrawal. Then I should know for sure if this is a more euphoric and sedating drug.
I'll post an update then.
Sounds good to me, I look forward to the report! Ya, I find gabapentin combined with other downers makes the downers seem more euphoric, so its crucial to try these GABA substances on their own. I don't really think a minimal dose of poppies will affect the euphoria much though, I know exactly how you feel having to take a little bit to prevent w/ds.
Trying it alone right now, and it still seems better than ethanol. The dose is higher this time. It seems sort of like the effects are somewhere between ethanol and benzos, and I feel no negatives at the moment. I'll edit this post or make a new one soon. I don't really know how to describe it. It certainly isn't like a clone of any drug I have tried.
I haven't even had my poppies yet. I'll do that soon so I don't start getting sick. I had a dose late last night so can wait an hour or two more.
I'm also writing a little trip report, or trying to, since this is such a rarely used substance.
Edit: Here is an update
I dosed some more, my total dose was a good deal higher than before. I was prepared to fall asleep, knowing it was pretty sedating when the dose is increased. I put on some music and lay down to listen. I didn't make it through more than a couple of songs before I was asleep and I slept for close to 4 hours. I didn't sleep more than an hour last night, so that is fine. I was feeling pretty good before falling asleep. The strong sedation at higher doses means that it probably doesn't have much recreational value at such levels.
The duration may not be as long as I thought. I am still feeling it pretty well, but I am at a much lower level than I was even before that last dose.
I feel slightly bad, but the feeling is that of the early stages of poppy withdrawal. I am about to have my dose of poppies. That should show me whether or not these negative effects are from lack of poppies or ingestion of this chemical. I've waited longer than usual to dose on poppies and I'd usually be starting to feel bad by now without them. I'd definitely feel worse either way if I had used ethanol like this, at least as best as I remember. I haven't been drunk in quite a long time, nor do I have any desire to get drunk.
It is possible that what I thought was lingering effects 10-12 hours post ingestion was nothing more than the usual sleepiness I feel for an hour or so after waking, with that interpretation reinforced by still being able to taste the chemical when I burped. It could have also taken longer to wear off because I took it on a full stomach. I really don't see there being any effects left in 5-7 hours, which would be about 10-12 hours after last dose. Still, it is going to be at least 8 hours total from last dose until I am back to baseline or something very close to it. I'm going to say the effects will probably end up lasting around 8 hours.
It seems like at least as far as immediate side effects go, this is less toxic than ethanol. What the long term effects of the chemical might be like, I don't know.
I'll update again in a little while to tell if the poppies remedied the bad feelings and to let you guys and gals know if any after effects appear.
Last edited by Tryptamine*Dreamer; 19-05-2009 at 02:19. Reason: Update info
I can't believe this drug was lost to time until now.
Remember, Methcathinone was found by a college intern at a pharmaceutical company looking at old records, who then spread/sold the process he worked up from the old patent and led to the Cat epidemic in Michigan in the early 90s.
Of the drugs we know of tens of thousands are patented but have never been tested for medicinal use.
A lot of recreational drugs are found by chance. Like Namenda, GHB, Cyclizine, etc.
- Join Date
- Jun 2008
ive dun it
Hopefully the poppies made you feel better, TD. 8 hours sounds more like what I'd expect from a substance like this, alot of the "rarer" GABAergic (chloral, GHB) drugs seem like they top out at around 6 hours or so. Hopefully you havent been using the stuff daily though, I'm guessing it'd have similar withdrawal symptoms to other GABA drugs, and we all know how painful those can be.
The long duration is one of the nicest aspects of this I think.
^It could be nice, because you wouldn't really have to redose. But knowing myself and how irresponsible I can be with wanting to up my dose by just one more benzo, or just another shot of vodka, when it comes to GABAergic drugs, I could see myself wanting to redose on this stuff, even when I shouldn't. So I guess if I ever do try this, I'd have to have someone with me to make sure that I don't try to redose until about 8 hours after the onset. Caution is a definite must when using downers with a long duration of action!
Its great that TD has been pretty careful and exact in his dosing and reporting of effects, not only for his own safety, but also because its really helpful for those of us learning about this substance!
Coolio--have you had the opportunity to try this one yet? I'd like to hear more about this one from as many people as possible.
Nope, I would try it for the novelty but I don't like ethanol or benzos anymore so I'm not interested in purchasing even the bare minimum amount of this to be able to try a few doses.