MODS- since mange can infect humans, and this is about (a canine's) healthy-living, I figured this would be more suited for this subforum than second opinion. Can it stay here? I think it will receive better answers here
My pitbull has always had some little rashes, typically the "base of spine/start of tail" area scabs/bumps/rashes.
However, there's this new rash that is starting to get kind of uncontrollable, and is definitely mange. Getting him to a vet is majorly problematic, especially since I have livestock-grade ivermectin on-hand (this is a legal product, I should add).
I have both an oral syrince and a proper (28gauge) syringe for muscular injections, and a 1% ivermectin (vetrimec brand) liquid on-hand. However, I'm seeing everything from oral, to intramuscular, to directly-on-affected-area protocols.
Any help is greatly appreciated. I've been bathing him, using fungisan (and he's being fully de-soaped before fungisan), etc, but it's just getting worse and I know I have to use the ivermectin, I'm just unsure how to use it as I haven't touched that kit in a long time (it's still good til Nov 2011 tho ;-P )
Again, thanks in advance for any help, I know I have what I need on-hand, but just unsure how to proceed with it. I cannot get photographs, however, I can tell you that it's at the point where, if you're close enough, you can see some spotting/thinning of his hair in the worst spots. He's not remotely near the "looks neglected" stage or anything, and I need to keep it that way!!
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Thread title made me LOL hard
- Join Date
- Jun 2010
What sort of dog is he? Ivermectin can be very toxic and fatal in some breeds!
As a coincidence, I am doing the same for my cats, I'll probably use it orally with a syringe rather than inject, since they are for topical application really, but there is nothign in them that would be harmful orally, it just wouldn't be sterile for IM/SubC injection. Rather than pay for a vet consultation and prescription I got 0.8% ivermectin off evilbay
Ivermectin is just about as effective given orally, but it tastes like shit, so it'd need to be squired down the back of the throat well diluted. That'd probably be safer than trying to give an IM/SubC injection, though if he really hates the taste it might not be safer for you!
Topical application ain't great except for ear mites, the mites burrow deep and it isn't absorbed through the skin very well.
The dosing regimen should be 1 dose every 1-2 weeks, as it kills the live mites, but not the eggs, so you need to wait till they hatch before they can be killed
OP, are you certain it's mange? does your pit have a mostly white coat?
ivermectin is mostly used as a livestock dewormer and to prevent heartworm infection in dogs.
i have 5 pit bulls and luckily none have had skin problems. however friends who have mostly white pits have troubles, usually in hot weather, with "hot spots". one friend spent big $$ at the vet and ended up clearing the problem w/ tea tree oil. i've also heard of ppl who have cleared up their dogs' "hot spots" w/ used motor oil.
i totally hear you about getting to the vet but it's really important to confirm or rule out both types of mange.
best of luck to you and your pit bull. i'd be curious to hear how things go.
I'm certain it's mange, and both types (sarcotic<sp?> and the other) can be treated with ivermectin IIRC. The problem is my (ex)fiance used to do the applications of ivermectin, and now it's me and my dog, with the ivermectin, but I didn't know how to use it. He's now in need of it but I'm unsure how to administer best in this situation, and cannot speak w/ my ex-fiance :-/
And no, he's dark-colored / not a breed that has issues with ivermectin, we used to administer it regularly, I just don't remember how!! Got my dog and the ivermectin but dunno wtf to do!! :P
Last edited by SangerRainsford; 12-03-2011 at 02:55.
Davestate- any further recommendations on specifics for dosing?
He's a 60lbs pit/lab-mutt, 100% okay with Ivermectin based on many previous experiences, and can receive an IM shot or an oral preparation (I can't be sure of his lineage, since as a general rule I only get/advocate adopted animals, but he has an extensive history of usage of the very same ivermectin preparation I've got on-hand). I can convert #'s and everything, but just don't know what to "dose" him with, like specific amount of ivermectin. (not looking for help with math/conversion/etc, just unsure what dose to give him, whether to change that dose once the mange is gone*, etc)
/*I intend to put him back on his normal ivermectin schedule after this is cleared up, but I'm not sure what his normal schedule is, what dosage to give him now, and whether those two dosages should be the same...
//he'll eat anything, and he takes IM shots like a champ, so administration comes down to which is best. If there's little difference, oral would be preferable to having to bust his needle out, but it's no problem whatsoever to administer an IM shot if need be, the solution/rig I have here are both for using Ivermectin intramuscularly, although I understand that the liquid could be used any way I chose.
- Join Date
- Jun 2010
Dosing according to Plumb's Vet Drug Handbook:
Typical dose is 400-600 mcg/kg by mouth every 24 hours. Your dog is 27kgs, so I'd start him at 200mcg/kg, which is 5.4mg's then work up to 10.8mg's by week 3
5.4mg's would be 0.54ml of 1% ivermectin
Now the above was taken straight from a gold standard vet textbook, however it can be very expensive! Personally, from vets I've heard that twice weekly dosing is enough, and even weekly dosing is fine too, and that it can take up to 8weeks to clear, so keep doing till symptoms clear, usually 4 weeks should be enough
Here is a few links verifying the dosage, just so you can be sure I'm not a sicko trying to poison by proxy!
Never used anything like that before, have treated mange mostly on the dogs I have rescued using olive oil with tea tree and eucalyptus added in. the mite itself is normally very short lived but you can see where it has spread. It is like scabies so best to treat early. Shampoo your dog using a medicated shampoo or putting a capful of dettol or tcp in a bath and give a good washing (wear gloves) once out dry the coat thoroughly then apply the olive oil with tea tree and eucalyptus this does not take long but I done this daily over a week to find the mange was gone.
I also washed bedding daily with eucalyptus and lemon oil so there was less likely a reinfection.
hope he is ok soon, you could also try phoning a vet and asking about dosage or the company who produce it, they should have guidelines you can work with.
To make sure I'm getting this, it's 400-600mcg/kg, so with a 1% solution, I'm going to need my initial ORAL dosage to be around 1/4th of a cc? I think I'll be more comfortable when I know I'm in the right range anyways, I've done the math over and over, get the same thing, and am still scared as hell to give him such a potent product. I've looked at tons of #'s, and have seen as low as 0.01cc for his weight - which has me scared shitless of OD'ing him, he's my best buddy!!
I know you're not poisoning by proxy ;-P Am I correct in saying that, given no mutation of that gene that allows BBB crossing of ivermectin, that I *can* give a 50lbs dog about 25% of 1cc? I can measure that, definitely cannot measure 1/100th (1 of a cc!!
((I'm wondering if I'm finding different #'s because of monthly versus daily apps. I know my ex used to give him the 1% monthly, and that she never had to really worry about dosing it (orally, but did have a proper syringe to measure it). But this is a case of dosing it daily, perhaps that's the huge spread in numbers, but even then when I multiply it out w/ half-life of ivermectin, the #'s don't add up!! God I'm missing something here, I think I'm just about to start him at 0.25cc or 25% of a cc worth for the day today, since it was reco'd (in your link, thnx again) to bring the animal up in dosage before getting to the maintenance level.))
Uuughhh....just broke the f'ing needle off of my only syringe, while it was in the 1% ivermectin bottle.
(I'm planning to just pour the 1% into a bottle and dilute it, so I can use my oral-syringe, that'd be fine right? Really have no interest in trying to find needles LOL)
- Join Date
- Mar 2011
I've read in several places that it's .1 cc / 10 lbs daily for heartworm prevention, and .3/ 10lbs for demodex. So for my 57lb pit bull I consider 1.5 cc her daily dose. I started at 1 to be safe but gradually got up to 1.5. She's been on it about a week and the improvements are great. She doesn't have the bumps anymore, and just seems more comfortable.
I just mix some treat in with her food (heated hot dog bits or boiled chicken bits, then sprinkle hot water on the food, then put the ivomec on top of the food and mix it in a little. I do just a couple cups full of the special mixture so she eats it all.
I turn the bottle of ivomec upside down and use the needle/syringe to suck up 1.5 cc's of it, then squirt it on the warm food mix.