Anybody have any insight on why we haven't seen this pop up as a mephedrone replacement at some point in time? Possible synth difficulties (obviously not going into detail) or expected nonactivity? I can't see any reason for the latter looking at other substituted cathinones, but at my low level of expertise that means very little.
I know 3,4 dimethylmethcathinone is market available, and we're now looking at prodrug versions (4-MBC), and even if this had been bioassayed to be worthless you would still think it would have hit the vendor sites at some point.
3-methylephedrone, 3-methylmethcathinone, 2-(methylamino)-1-(3-methylphenyl)-1-propanone, 3-MeMMC
Erowid Experience Reports Index - 3-MMC
Moderator Note: As with most RC cathinones, chemicals sold as 3-MMC may contain other cathinone analogs such as 4-MEC, 4-MMC/mephedrone and others. Always err on the side of caution when using RCs such as 3-MMC.
Results 1 to 25 of 177
- Join Date
- Jul 2011
Last edited by NeighborhoodThreat; 08-06-2013 at 00:02. Reason: the beginnings of a megathread
I would also like to know this
As far as I know 3-substitution brings up the possibility of excessive 5-ht2b agonism and resulting heart valve silliness. Plus 3-sub cathinones are not always that exciting (see: buproprion)
- Join Date
- Apr 2006
3-MMC is meant to be quite good, but is more difficult to make than mephedrone, and such a close analogue that it is banned almost everywhere mephedrone is. Even in countries where there are no analogue provisions as such, "isomers" of the scheduled compound are generally also covered, and a 3-methyl vs 4-methyl would most likely be considered an isomer.
- Join Date
- Aug 2011
I've just stumbled upon this chemical on some reputable vendors site, and even though cathinones are not exactly my cup of tea these days, I would like to hear some more about this isomer.
Should we expect it put too much cardiac pressure as mentioned by Sekio or there is a chance that we'll have more potent (and clean) substitute to 4MMC here?
It's not cardiac pressure I am worried about, it's the same shit that got fenfluramine killed by the FDA - your heart valves are encourgaed to grow too rapidly by some stimulant compounds.
The fluorocathinones have been around for equally as long as mephedrone, the rule of thumb is that none of them share the 'magic' of meph/methylone.
but the problem with fenfluramien was that it was a drug which you take on a daily base Im pretty sure that MDMA would also cause this heart valve problems when taking it on a daily base so I would not say that 3-MMC/4-mmc is any more dangerous/toxic then MDMA when taken responsible and not too often (like it is with every drug)
As a rule of thumb, these cathinone compounds cause self-administration in many cases. I have heard of lots of reports of people doing way more than they intended with 'bath salts' - I think it's better safe than sorry when it comes to designing drugs with that in mind.
MDMA, suprisingly, does not cause heart valve hypertrophy, nor do most of the psychedelics, even though studies indicate it has a direct effect on heart valve cells. I still wouldn't use any of those daily...
well according to this review article (http://xa.yimg.com/kq/groups/1518653...icle170909.pdf) MDMA has a influence on cardiac fibrosis as mdma is a non selective 5HT2B agonist so it is quite likely that it will mediate this effect, I didnt checked the referenced papers though.
Recreational drug use: MDMA (ecstasy)
3,4 methylenedioxymethamphetamine (MDMA), an
amphetamine-based drug, is a psychoactive stimulant
used for recreational purposes. Use of MDMA has
increased over the past two decades to more than 3% of all
people in the USA.64 In 2007, Droogmans and colleagues65
reported the development of signifi cant valvular
regurgitation in eight (28%) people who took MDMA
compared with none in the control group (p=0·0045). The
investigators noted a correlation between dose and severity
of valvulopathy. Analysis of valve morphology identifi ed
restrictive valvular heart disease similar to that seen in
patients taking pergolide. Patients had a mean age of
24·3 years and took an average of 3·6 tablets of MDMA
per week for 6 years. Most MDMA use is intermittent and
recreational, although its place in the treatment of
post-traumatic stress disorder is being assessed.66 The
eff ect of long-term use has not been established.
Just found out some info in another popular public forum in a discussion about meph ban from 2011:
China banned production of the meph pre cursor
4-methylpropiophenone which contains up to 10% 3-methylpropiophenone (technical grade reagent). Separation of 3-methylmethcathinone from 4-methylmethcathinone is difficult. On large scale, multiple recrystallizations are required which I doubt most RC manufacturers would do because of lost material and thus lost profit - hence the impurity. Thats why chinese meph was different as it contained 3-mmc as a by product which happened to give you a better buzz,although bad for your health.They were losing too much product in washing it out.China was main world producer of 4-methylpropiophenone so when it dried up i presume thats when india started producing meph but were unable to get the banned pre cursors so used probably one of these methods,both produce mephedrone but none of them contain 3-mmc in the final product.Cleaner yes but the buzz is not as intense as the 3-mmc was helpin the chink gears potency.
It can also be produced by oxidising the ephedrine analogue (4-methylephedrine) [...] Because 4-methylephedrine can be obtained in a specific enantiomeric form it is possible to produce mephedrone consisting of only one enantiomer.
A stereospecific form of (S)-mephedrone could be prepared via [other methods].
There are more synth recipies about but none contain 3-mmc in the final product unless 4-methylpropiophenone was used as the pre cursor.
So the unavailability of the more potent pre-ban style 4-MMC is a direct result of smaller laboratories/manufacturers being forced into utilizing various other methods of synthesis through certain banned precursors being difficult to obtain effectively resulting in production not being very cost-effective?
Last edited by sekio; 23-05-2012 at 02:33. Reason: chomp synth discussion & pseudo-ads
If I saw some GC/MS traces that suggested that, I'd be more likely to believe it, but that does make sense... this is what happens when you use 90% "tech grade" reagent...
23-05-2012 08:49Originally Posted by Torabora
As 3-mmc is supposedly available now I guess we will see some trip reports very shortly.
Review from a dutch forum:
I had this week 3MMC ordered last night and tested. Had gotten the message that it should resemble 4MMC (mephedrone so), do let's try.
About 4MMC read everywhere (do not experience) that it is very short and spiky works so great urge to take, but that it hardly causes hangovers, and the latter drew me to have to try it.
Quietly begun in the first 2 hours several times until he bijgepakt something good was, and from that moment nothing bijgepakt because it was totally not as short-acting and wispy like what I read about 4MMC. It was great, felt great just like on MDMA, including the flickering eyes, grinding teeth, and large pupils. But very clear in my head, just like on 6apb. But the big advantage I found that I was not so much collapsed as with MDMA, I had some good energy, a lot of sense to talk, and after smoking a joint was totally super! When was the vagueness there, just as with MDMA.
3 to 4 hours after the last dose, I go to sleep, but my teeth were still raging, and sleep was pretty hard the first few hours. But it was not really alone in bed feeling fine. Several hours later, still asleep and sleep for several hours.
Now the next day, obviously feel that I did something yesterday, but not comparable to MDMA or 6apb. I am now even a sandwich with peanut butter to eat, something I totally after mdma/6apb to consider.
How your body may feel raped after MDMA I now totally, just a little tired and some vaguely still, while the effect was really super.
Wait and see how the hangover is about to expire, but this seems to be my new favorite!
Joined: Thu May 20, 2012 3:40 pm
Another minor addition with respect to the effect, mentally it felt like a combination of 6apb/mdma, so euphoric, social, etc, but with the brightness of 6apb. But what I miss in 6apb is a little body load that MDMA can give you that warmth and waves / gusts of tingling throughout your body. In 6apb I get it a bit warmer, but not really feeling that MDMA, which was at 3MMC present. Also super sense to talk, whatever happened all the time, and more energy than mdma/6apb I think.
And the best thing I found is that it works within 10 minutes already, so no endless waiting like 6apb where it may take 2 hours before you are really good in it. Now it's just a line address, and before you know it he starts al
Now it is 2 days after I had used, and the hangover is now completely gone. Wait and see if there is a dip tomorrow.
If you are interested, perhaps I would have put a full trip report together.
I'm still skeptical of the veracity of this report: it's just too glowing for something where SAR suggests a compound very similar to methcathinone (a vanilla NE/DA releaser with prominent adrenergic effects) (said sar is generalized from known 3-substituted amphetamines).
- Join Date
- Jul 2009
4-FMC is pretty balanced releaser, where 3-fmc is a pure NE-buzz. Don't expect to much.
- Join Date
- Feb 2008
I might try 3-MMC one day, pretty sure this one has been in the works for a long long time, but as above posters said: it's good to keep some skepticism, particularly with knock-off cathinones
- Join Date
- May 2012
Swim tried some of this today from a vendor that he considers legit (lets call it *no vendor discussion*). Swim said it was Not like 4-mmc at all. Lot of eye shaking, sweating and shaking at higher doses very little euphoria. Earlier in the thread someone said that it's the impurity in Chinese mephedrone and from this trial at least swim thinks that's all it is. Although it is the first batch and may get better. Doubt it.
Last edited by NeighborhoodThreat; 18-12-2012 at 15:25. Reason: nope.
Assuming pre-ban Meph really contained as much as 10% 3-MMC (I've not bothered to check sources for that number yet), then this may well be a good "mixer" chem that's pretty boring on it's own but nice in combination, like MDAI but the other way around.
Is there anyone out there who has access to post-ban meph that isn't cut to fuck with random psychoactives? I'd very much like to see how well it combo's with 3-MMC. I've no idea if my old (street) source still sells any as I wasn't impressed with it. Assumed it was cut with 4-MEC or something given the potency of material and effects, although it may not have been cut all assuming the pre-ban Meph did actually contain significant amounts of 3-MMC
I'll probably pick up a gram or two to experiment with and see how well it combines with MDAI and 4-MEC (not at the same time). 6-APB and Methylone might combo well too. I don't have any of these chems (except 6-APB) at the moment so I won't be able to post any results for another week. In the mean time I'll try and keep away from the peev and try to pass on 4-FA monday night (depending on Blood Alcohol Content)... I'm strangely excited by this one and want fair trials.
yea I wonder how a combination of 3-mmc with 4-emc plays out could be great
- Join Date
- May 2010